And so the people who for financial reasons could not keep up their sub and buy RoK, but who are thrilled to be able to return to EQII as it is one of their favorite games, are automatically disloyal? I bought RoK and reactivated literally the day before the promo started, june 1st. It was seriously the first time I could afford to. I will not appreciate any 'get a better job' etc. comments. The reasons for my lack of money are personal, and family related.I don't really think loyalty really has anything to do with this whole situation. I probably shouldn't say anything, but it hurts me that people with longstanding subs think less of me simply because I could not afford to keep my sub going since I activated 2 years ago. I pay for it every time I have the spare cash to do so, and am always happy to return. I was hoping to see a community happy to see us returners, and not assuming we were all going to simply leave after the free time. Many of us will stay. I intend to but if this is the icy reception I can expect, perhaps I am not welcome anymore.
Kendricke wrote:Luier wrote:<snip>Though this situation isn't exactly the same as that, the basic and essential logic is the same. Basically, by choosing to continue subscribing to Everquest II, players who have been here all along have actually lost out on in-game rewards and out-of-game remuneration that players who had cancelled are currently receiving. By choosing to stay, these players get everything they've always had access to. However, had those players chosen to leave, they'd have all that and more. The point you are leaving out, however, is that those who did stay and paid for ROK also got to play it while those who recieved the promo are just now begining to play it. In other words, you got what you paid for and nothing less and yet you choose to complain about others recieving a promo to come back to the game and increase the population.
Luier wrote:<snip>Though this situation isn't exactly the same as that, the basic and essential logic is the same. Basically, by choosing to continue subscribing to Everquest II, players who have been here all along have actually lost out on in-game rewards and out-of-game remuneration that players who had cancelled are currently receiving. By choosing to stay, these players get everything they've always had access to. However, had those players chosen to leave, they'd have all that and more.
<snip>
Though this situation isn't exactly the same as that, the basic and essential logic is the same. Basically, by choosing to continue subscribing to Everquest II, players who have been here all along have actually lost out on in-game rewards and out-of-game remuneration that players who had cancelled are currently receiving. By choosing to stay, these players get everything they've always had access to. However, had those players chosen to leave, they'd have all that and more.
The point you are leaving out, however, is that those who did stay and paid for ROK also got to play it while those who recieved the promo are just now begining to play it. In other words, you got what you paid for and nothing less and yet you choose to complain about others recieving a promo to come back to the game and increase the population.
Who said I'm complaining about increasing population? Go back through my responses within this discussion and you'll see that's not the simplistic black or white case you seem to make it out to be. It's not only possible, but entirely feasible that someone who disagrees with you regarding the promotional rewards is still happy to see additional players joining the game. Disagreeing with you on the subject doesn't make anyone an "idiot" or a "forum troll".
The question I've asked and which no one seems to have an answer for, is whether or not the promtion REQUIRED such exclusive rewards as $5 off the next expansion, in-game pets, titles, or otherwise in order to increase the playerbase. Can you honestly tell me that if those rewards weren't available, players wouldn't come back? ...that the only reason those players are here now is because of those in-game items or rewards? ...that if SOE offered the $5 discount to longstanding subscribers, it would mean that returning players would not return or purchase the next expansion?
Either those rewards have real value or they do not. If the answer is "yes, they have real value", then you can't just overlook the fact that current players are going to want a method to access those rewards as well. If, instead, the answer is "no, those rewards have no real value", then there's no justifiable reason that the rewards can't also be made available in some fashion to current players. Logically speaking, you can't have it both ways - either the promotional items have real value or not.
Luier wrote:Kendricke wrote:Luier wrote:<snip>Though this situation isn't exactly the same as that, the basic and essential logic is the same. Basically, by choosing to continue subscribing to Everquest II, players who have been here all along have actually lost out on in-game rewards and out-of-game remuneration that players who had cancelled are currently receiving. By choosing to stay, these players get everything they've always had access to. However, had those players chosen to leave, they'd have all that and more. The point you are leaving out, however, is that those who did stay and paid for ROK also got to play it while those who recieved the promo are just now begining to play it. In other words, you got what you paid for and nothing less and yet you choose to complain about others recieving a promo to come back to the game and increase the population.Who said I'm complaining about increasing population? Go back through my responses within this discussion and you'll see that's not the simplistic black or white case you seem to make it out to be. It's not only possible, but entirely feasible that someone who disagrees with you regarding the promotional rewards is still happy to see additional players joining the game. Disagreeing with you on the subject doesn't make anyone an "idiot" or a "forum troll".The question I've asked and which no one seems to have an answer for, is whether or not the promtion REQUIRED such exclusive rewards as $5 off the next expansion, in-game pets, titles, or otherwise in order to increase the playerbase. Can you honestly tell me that if those rewards weren't available, players wouldn't come back? ...that the only reason those players are here now is because of those in-game items or rewards? ...that if SOE offered the $5 discount to longstanding subscribers, it would mean that returning players would not return or purchase the next expansion? Either those rewards have real value or they do not. If the answer is "yes, they have real value", then you can't just overlook the fact that current players are going to want a method to access those rewards as well. If, instead, the answer is "no, those rewards have no real value", then there's no justifiable reason that the rewards can't also be made available in some fashion to current players. Logically speaking, you can't have it both ways - either the promotional items have real value or not.
Yes they have value, no you cannot get them!
Now, are you going to keep crying, quit, or just accept it?
Being loyal has nothing to do with discounts or prizes, it has to do with being committed to a game, community or guild. A loyal person doesn't cancel an account every time a new mmo comes out, they don't change servers every 2 months if the grass looks greener and they don't change guilds every time another guild looks better. Loyalty is important to an mmo and disloyalty deserves no reward. People that flake on the game will flake on every other commitment in the game and in my opinion aren't worth targeting for population growth.People that aren't loyal see no value in loyalty.
Being loyal has nothing to do with discounts or prizes, it has to do with being committed to a game, community or guild. A loyal person doesn't cancel an account every time a new mmo comes out, they don't change servers every 2 months if the grass looks greener and they don't change guilds every time another guild looks better. Loyalty is important to an mmo and disloyalty deserves no reward. People that flake on the game will flake on every other commitment in the game and in my opinion aren't worth targeting for population growth.
People that aren't loyal see no value in loyalty.
Is it needed? vasicly yes, have more players coming back now then ever before.
The thing you keep glossing over about the pets - returning players do NOT get them, the people that current players recruit get them, it is a bonus for NEW accounts.
The items have no intrisinic value, funny thing - you KNOW for a fact right now that SOE is not going to offer a discount to the regualr players in the next round? Unless you have seen the upcoming additions to this promotion you have no idea.
It is funny to go back over the previous years of your posts, bith here and in eq1 and see how things have changed.
Can you honestly tell me that if those rewards weren't available, players wouldn't come back?
Not in every case, obviously, but I personally know two players who would not be back on the server right now had it not been for these rewards.
I've a feeling they're not the only ones, either.
There's really only two ways to get SOE to change their stance on something. Continue posting for about 3 months and they will make this a limited time frame veteran reward as they have done with all of the stuff in SWG when they were giving out in game items like candy to attract new players and treating their current and loyal client base like trash, or quit en masse and smack their pocket book.
The developers and those above them are extremely difficult to get to sway from their line of thinking once they have made up their mind that this fits the "vision" of the game, which is one of the reasons that their hold on the MMO market is beginning to slip. They're still making a profit, but not nearly what they could be doing if they weren't so difficult to persuade that their ideas are bad ones.
The really sad thing is that there's really nothing cool enough on the market to warrant me switching games and it wouldn't take much to get me to switch to a different company, but it would have to be one that did things completely different than SOE and not another SOE clone.
I'm currently a student at DeVry taking their Gaming/Simulation Programming course and the one thing that every game development class stresses beyond anything else is that if you want something to succeed, you have to put your feelings aside and write what the gamers want and treat them ALL equal. Alienate one side and you'll regret it at some point.
Kendricke wrote:Can you honestly tell me that if those rewards weren't available, players wouldn't come back?Not in every case, obviously, but I personally know two players who would not be back on the server right now had it not been for these rewards.I've a feeling they're not the only ones, either.
So, they came back because of the in-game titles? You managed to find someone willing to try out the game purely because of the in-game pet drake? Both of those players would quit today if the titles and pets were made available, in some form or fashion, to existing customers?
Flaye@Mistmoore wrote:Kendricke wrote:Can you honestly tell me that if those rewards weren't available, players wouldn't come back?Not in every case, obviously, but I personally know two players who would not be back on the server right now had it not been for these rewards.I've a feeling they're not the only ones, either.So, they came back because of the in-game titles? You managed to find someone willing to try out the game purely because of the in-game pet drake? Both of those players would quit today if the titles and pets were made available, in some form or fashion, to existing customers?
Respectfully: How many times are you going to lie?
In case you dont know, new and returing players DO NOT GET THE DRAKE! The drake is for CURRENT PLAYERS who sign up others starting July 1, 2008.
Would I like to have all the "free goodies" as a long time player? Sure.
But frankly, seeing folks complaining in the chat over the weekend that "the level 1-9 and 10-19 channels are full - what's up with that!?" Makes me happier than any "freebee"!
\m/
Kendricke wrote:Luier wrote:Kendricke wrote:Luier wrote:<snip>Though this situation isn't exactly the same as that, the basic and essential logic is the same. Basically, by choosing to continue subscribing to Everquest II, players who have been here all along have actually lost out on in-game rewards and out-of-game remuneration that players who had cancelled are currently receiving. By choosing to stay, these players get everything they've always had access to. However, had those players chosen to leave, they'd have all that and more. The point you are leaving out, however, is that those who did stay and paid for ROK also got to play it while those who recieved the promo are just now begining to play it. In other words, you got what you paid for and nothing less and yet you choose to complain about others recieving a promo to come back to the game and increase the population.Who said I'm complaining about increasing population? Go back through my responses within this discussion and you'll see that's not the simplistic black or white case you seem to make it out to be. It's not only possible, but entirely feasible that someone who disagrees with you regarding the promotional rewards is still happy to see additional players joining the game. Disagreeing with you on the subject doesn't make anyone an "idiot" or a "forum troll".The question I've asked and which no one seems to have an answer for, is whether or not the promtion REQUIRED such exclusive rewards as $5 off the next expansion, in-game pets, titles, or otherwise in order to increase the playerbase. Can you honestly tell me that if those rewards weren't available, players wouldn't come back? ...that the only reason those players are here now is because of those in-game items or rewards? ...that if SOE offered the $5 discount to longstanding subscribers, it would mean that returning players would not return or purchase the next expansion? Either those rewards have real value or they do not. If the answer is "yes, they have real value", then you can't just overlook the fact that current players are going to want a method to access those rewards as well. If, instead, the answer is "no, those rewards have no real value", then there's no justifiable reason that the rewards can't also be made available in some fashion to current players. Logically speaking, you can't have it both ways - either the promotional items have real value or not. Yes they have value, no you cannot get them! Now, are you going to keep crying, quit, or just accept it?
Kendricke wrote:Flaye@Mistmoore wrote:Kendricke wrote:Can you honestly tell me that if those rewards weren't available, players wouldn't come back?Not in every case, obviously, but I personally know two players who would not be back on the server right now had it not been for these rewards.I've a feeling they're not the only ones, either.So, they came back because of the in-game titles? You managed to find someone willing to try out the game purely because of the in-game pet drake? Both of those players would quit today if the titles and pets were made available, in some form or fashion, to existing customers? Respectfully: How many times are you going to lie?In case you dont know, new and returing players DO NOT GET THE DRAKE! The drake is for CURRENT PLAYERS who sign up others starting July 1, 2008.
