Crit healing effect and critical healing magnitude

Discussion in 'Powers, Weapons, and Movement' started by ARCHIVED-Obeahx, Feb 8, 2011.

  1. Can someone pls confirm the difference and which one is more important to healers? I get mix opinion on these two stats from other post and from dcu wiki.
    DCU Wiki says its important but it doesn't clarify the crit magnitude. Previous post (http://forums.station.sony.com/dcuo...?topic_id=14650) have other opinion. Any confirmation pls?
  2. Obeahx wrote:
    This is becoming annoying. Critical Healing Effect and Critical Healing Magnitude are the exact same thing, however!
    On descriptions on passive bonuses, the titles of the two critical healing effects are clearly stated as: Critical Healing CHANCE and Critical Healing MAGNITUDE.
    The Critical Healing Magnitude is the title of the passive ability which grants a Critical Healing Effect. Don't get confused with the word 'effect'. I've noticed 1 person gets confused by not understanding and the topic becomes debatable when there is no issue to begin with!
  3. chance is how often you get a crit

    i think magnitude is how big that crit is or how many sequencial crits you get when one procs
  4. after much thinking reading calculating and testing of randomness i'm very certain that the effects of critical healing magnitude is what controls the size of the crit, and critical healing effect applies to the current % of your magnitude.
    you can get 20% magnitude from inates.
    and +48% critical healing effect.
    if i'm correct you get roughly 30% to crit magnitude.
    the reason i believe this is, as was mentioned earlier, the skills are labeled Critical Healing magnitude but says increases the critical healing effect.
    Hope this was helpful, and hope i'm correct. Happy Healing
  5. Razzmin wrote:
    Yeah, I have mentioned this before a few times myself.
    My take on it originally, was based on EQOA, the other SOE MMO (was Ps2 only).
    Critical Heal Chance - self explainitory.
    Critical Heal Effect - Raises the lowest amount a Crit can hit for.
    Critical Heal Magnitude - Raises they Highest amount a Crit can hit for.
    I havn't really tested this, I am not all that concerned about it, I did minimul testing a while back, and made this assumtion for 2 reasons. One, my experience appeared to support it. Two, my years of experience in the other SoE MMO had similar mechanics.
    Again, I am not claiming to know more or less then anyone else, just theorcrafting.
  6. I'm always confused by this question, because I don't think I have ever seen the words "critical healing effect" alone in any icon/tooltip set. For me, they've always been followed by "magnitude" or "chance". Maybe they exist, but I'd remember seeing them as I'd probably wonder what they meant too. I'm a sorc healer, so resto and crits are my focus, and I've seen Restoration +, Critical effect magnitude +, critical effect chance +, but never critical effect +. Take that for what it's worth.
  7. Crit Chance: how often you crit
    Crit Magnitude: increases how large your crits are
  8. Lokai wrote:
    We all are in agreement on this, its not in debate. Its the areas in the skills that say "critical healing effect" that is in discussion. crit chance and crit magnitude and what they do is pretty common knowledge, but thanks anyway.
    Example: Hand blasters, bottom tier, 0/3 specifically says:
    [Innate]
    Permanently increase statistics: Boost Critical Healing Effect by 4% per point.
    Bow,bottom tier, 0/3 :
    [Innate]
    Permanently increase statistics: Boost Critical Healing Effect by 4% per point.
    One Handed, bottom tier, 0/3 :
    [Innate]
    Permanently increase statistics: Boost Critical Healing Effect by 4% per point.
    Staff, bottom tier, 0/3 :
    [Innate]
    Permanently increase statistics: Boost Critical Healing Effect by 4% per point.
    All of these are discriptions in the dark blue area under the light blue tab with the effects or abilities tittle, but only in the ones that are 0/3
    The other have the description such as "Allows access to Staff Weapons and the Staff Weapons Tree.
    Permanently Gain: +2% Critical Healing Magnitude."
    Hence the debate, is there a difference in "Magnitude" and "Effect" in this instance.
  9. Critical Healing Magnitude -> Critical Healing Effect
    That's how you could think about it. Critical Healing Effect is the overall amount that a critical heal could heal for. Incrase this precentage and you will do more with a critical heal. Critical Healing Magnitude is the name for the specific skill that you it listed under.
    The added bonuses default to magnitude to reference the actual skill name.
    In practice, Critical Healing Magnitude = Critical Healing Effect.
    The most likely reason why this particular skill has two different names is more likely to be name change error. Why do I believe this? No other skill refers to a different name in their descriptions. Critical Attack Chance, Critical Attack Damage and Critical Healing Chance both use the term in the title and the descriptions.
    Try not to make the system more complicated than it actually is. :p
  10. ARCHIVED-BKG Guest

    Superskull85 wrote:
    Correct.
    Also I'll extensively argue that Crit Healing + Crit Magnitute > Max Restoration.
  11. I've tested the magnitude abilities. I have the iconic power magnitude and 3/3 bow increase to healing crit magnitude. With both of them I have a 22% increase to healing critical effect. However it doesn't work on other people. With these abilities I can crit for around 3200-3300 at the highest. Without them I can crit for 3200-3300 the highest on _other people_.

    The weapon abilities that give critical healing magnitude seem to only work when you receive a critical heal.... not when you cast it. So if you're a tank, and you get those abilities, you can get crit healed for more. If someone else could verify or debunk my claim with their own tests, that would be appreciated.
  12. Each weapon that does healing, has one of the two Healing EFFECTS. Either it's Crit Healing Magnitude, or Crit Healing Chance.
    In the trees for those weapons, the "Crit Healing Effect" is simply the effect that specific weapon has. If you have a weapon that gives you the bonus for Crit Healing Magnitude as soon as you choose the weapon tree, than the "Crit Healing Effect" is merely the bonus to Crit Healing Magnitude.
    If you have a weapon that gives you Crit Healing Chance as soon as you choose the weapon tree, then the healing effect is merely the added bonus to Crit Healing Chance.
    There you go.
  13. MrBionic wrote:
    So are weapon-based skills for crit healing chance and effect applied during the spell cast, or the spell effect? Have you tested that your heals actually crit higher with increased magnitude from abilities on _other_ people? Have any math to back it up?
  14. Guido wrote:
    Chance and Magnitude become innate. It means they are imbued into you and your abilities as if you were born with them.They all work the same for you as they do for the ones you cast them on, anyone who says different needs to do more testing.
    I have tested extensively, and yes, the critical magnitude, absolutely raises the level of heal your abilities crit for.
    I can raise my crit heal mag up by 121+%
    At base restoration and base crit mag, Roar heals for roughly 100 health consistantly. Criting around 150.
    At 1200 restoration it heals for roughly 225, and crits for 330-350.
    I have often crited for 800. I used it in Containment, and the Bat cave last night and saw crits over 800 with roar on quite a regular occasion.
  15. Coglin wrote:
    So you're saying that with 1200 restoration you heal and crit for more. Yes, that should be common knowledge. That doesn't have anything to do with weapon crit magnitude.
    Crit effect = 1.5*
    225 * 1.5 = 337
    100 * 1.5 = 150
    This does not demonstrate an increase of 20+% or more.
    With the bow ability (12%) and iconic power (10%), you should have 172% crit effect. 225 * 1.72 = 387
  16. Guido wrote:
    Are you just being a troll, are you really so simple that you missed the part that I had to Italic, bold, put in red, and underline, or are you just being a smart azz?
    I specifically gave you numbers for what it heals and crits at 1200 restoration without crit magnitude, then I gave you what it does with my crit magnitude.
    Critical effect is not 1.5 as your base heals fluxuate, so do your critcals. You do not crit for max or minimum every time. Like it was in the old "on paper D&D days" its a role of the dice, with critical magnitude being the highest number on the dice avaliable.
    Critical effect with no magnitude is 1.01X-1.5X base.
    If you read, I clearly stated what the base heal was at 1200. thus already clearifying that obviously it healed and crited for more.
    Thats why I said at base restoration it healed for roughly 100
    THEN
    I clearified that it was roughly 225 at 1200....
    So yeah, being as crits are relative to base, then obviously the crits are higher.
    Add in the +45% crit magnitude from insectoid form, the +35 from Hive mind (might be more, i am going off memory atm), and the +51% I get from weapons skills. and I have seen some 800+ crits from roar. not to mention Hive mind adds +35% restoretion.
    I just through that out there so they could make there own deccission of critical magnitude value. There was no nead to attept to to talk down to me by quoting my post and pointing out the obvious, implying I was unaware. Since i clearly stated " I can raise my crit heal mag up by 121+%".
    I didn't say i raised it to 121%, I clearly stated it raised it by 121+%.........45+35+51=121, for a total of 131, hence i said 121+. thats a total crit mag of 281%, and it may be more if I underestimated the Hive mind percentage added.
  17. How do you know there aren't other buffs in effect? I'm only skeptical because 225*2.81 is 632... and that would be your potential highest amount possible with metabolism by your math, right?(roar is a damage effect, no?). I'm really not trying to be a troll or anything here. I just want to know how these skills work like anyone else and I don't see the math adding up to backup the tooltip.
  18. Guido wrote:
    Roar is only a damage effect in in DPS stance, in healer stance its 3 tic DoT turns to a 3 tic Hot, both stances still stunn enemies. I know no other buffs were out there because I was constantly checking my buff/statis screen.
    BTW I was going of memmory before, now I am in game and Hive mind is 100% to crit magnitude, not 35%. so thats a total of 346% not the 281 I was guessing at previously.
  19. Hi Ty everyone for your time and some enlightenment. Anyways I just focus my stat on crit>magnitude/effect>restoration. I have 53 skillpoints and I can get all crits and effects/mag but not all resto pasives but Im very happy with the result. With hivemind in effect (but not in bug form), my roar can hit crit around 1100 in many occasions in raids. So yeah, roar all the way for nature healer. Again thanks everyone, esp to excellent nature guides by Scrump, Grassland and blanefirehand (its a must read for nature healer!!)
  20. The way I have understood the two is this (and how others I know believe it to be; it is not a typo):
    Critical Healing MAGNITUDE increases how much a Healer's Crit Heal will do IN GENERAL. As in if I have increased Magnitude, it will heal me or anyone more no matter what than me not having.
    Critical Healing EFFECT increases how much A critical heal affects YOU. As in, if a Healer's heal Crits, their Crit Heals will do more if YOU--the target-- has Critical Healing EFFECT. You should get even more Healing from their Critical Heal if you have Critical Healing EFFECT (something TANKS definitely want to get).
    So Critical Healing EFFECT is essentially great across the boar--every class benefits from getting it if they want it--but Critical Heal MAGNITUDE is something really only a Healer would need to get. I do not know how often Fire Tanks/DPS crit with their Heal move though; if often enough it may warrant them getting Critical Healing MAGNITUDE as well.

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