Discussion in 'Heavy Assault' started by Zamos, Nov 28, 2012.
So does it worth spending certs on my Orion - Carv equivalent ?
I am uncertain of what you are asking.
I guess he asks if he should spend certs in the stock SAW or not.
Zamos: If you don't want to get another lmg soon, yes, I think a few upgrades (forward grip, optics) can/will make your life easier. Just a matter of time to get those certs 'back', and that depends on how much time you can invest into the game.
The default SAW requires a 330 cert investment to match any other NC LMGs 130-230. If you've already fully attached a Gauss SAW S, GD-22S, or EM6 fully, don't bother.
If the SAW is your only LMG, I'd recommend using it with Advanced Forward Grip/Compensator/4x or 6x scope. Almost every(maybe every?) NC LMG has an identical 0m 100% accuracy TTK, their differences are in how recoil, damage dropoff, and ADS CoF bloom is handled at ranges. The SAW is a *perfect* balance of those once fully equipped, but it's not a difference worth spending 330 certs on if you already have one of the previously listed LMGs finished.
Edit: I assume this is what you were talking about? The GD-22S is the NC->VS inbetween weapon, and the EM1/6 should be NC->TR inbetween weapons.
Spending on the default SAW. No.
Go straight to the EM6 (my preference, when I NC).
EM6 gets compensator and good ROF.
EM1 gets softpoint and a bit faster reloads, but is less accurate and does not get compensator.
The Guass SAW is the best LMG in the game for longer engagements. It's slow ROF and recoil aren't problems when you're shooting one or two shots at a time. It has the highest damage of any LMG and is the longest range before dropoff occurs. But if you don't planning on using it for longer range combat, go with the EM6.
All depends on what you're going to do. I fully upgraded mine and thought it worked just fine like all the other NC guns. They all need an accuracy + rof buff but it's nothing game breaking.
NC weapons are unique from TR and VS ones in that you retain near perfect precision when standing still (they have zero COF spread). This is why you'll never see an accuracy buff on the guns, they already have an accuracy buff built in. The recoil still exists, but recoil can be controlled through skill. Managing the recoil while standing still makes the weapon into a burst firing master, which means aiming for the head will see multiple shots landing there. Higher damage on NC weapons (as high as 200 on the SAW) means those headshot bursts are lethal.
If you want to run and gun, you need to switch to TR. NC weapons are designed to shoot while standing.
Not entirely true. Specifically:
-There is still CoF spread, even in stationary crouched ADS. They are on average more precise than most TR and VS weapons though.
-Semi-random alternating direction hoizontal recoil cannot be compensated for unless you're cheating, in which case you'd just go ahead and flat out disable the recoil entirely. All guns have it but NC have it on average significantly worse than other factions. It means that weapons with sustained fire will in ideal conditions hit 50% of the time after crossing some specific range distance depending on how bad it is, and it is closer on NC than other factions(again on average. some guns are built for x and others for y but the "NC recoil penalty" applies to them all). This oddly works directly against having a more precise ADS CoF.
-Standing still has no effect on recoil.
The rest is pretty accurate though. Honestly in my opinion in three months anyone who cares enough will be sporting the "crossover" type weapon of the faction they hate the most so I don't really see what the big deal is. I personally love the SAW but I hate all the ARs except the GR-22(very similar to Cycler, slightly more oriented to close range). I'd imagine once I get around to setting up a carbine it's going to be whichever NC one has that mimics the VX-78 or whatever carbine VS has that is the best gun in the game on paper.
The Gauss SAW, IMHO, is the best NC LMG, I haven't played any other faction so I wouldn't be able to comment on their LMGs.
The SAW is perfect for defending rooms, doors, hallways, it is also good for flanking. I have a three separate optics that I use (2x reflex, IR, and 4x scope) depending on the environment. I have the advanced forward grip and the compensator and I love it. I rarely find myself in CQC as I usually work with a good squad and that task is left to better suited classes. Doing perimeter sweeps of tech labs and amp stations is amazing with this.
However, it does require the most skill to use out of the other NC LMGs, due to the slow rate of fire, you will feel each round that does not hit.
The default SAW is an awful weapon currently, no matter how much "skill" you have it flat out does less damage than other LMGs because of its awful fire rate (and it has awful recoil to boot). I would recommend skipping it and going for one of the EM LMGs or the GD-22 (only 100 certs I believe which is about what it costs for any of the upgrades anyhow).
As much as it is possible to combat poor accuracy/recoil by burst firing and general recoil management, being able to NOT have to burst fire as much is an advantage, skilled or not, because if one guy is hitting accurately with burst fire, and the other guy is hitting accurately with full auto, the guy shooting full auto is going to win. Plus the raw dps of the SAW is low anyhow due to its poor rate of fire.
I personally found the GD-22 just as good as any of the NC LMGs for what it's worth, though the smaller clip can be a bummer at times and I ended up going with the EM6 because I had it with alpha squad anyhow and it appears to be the most well rounded of the LMGs, but it is one of the expensive ones.
At least post factual information. Like this: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/pub?key=0AuOojvNLMApVdEtIU1NKenEzNzZOSWNaanFqSUVxLWc&gid=12
SAW at 10m: 1667 dps
EM1(better close range) at 10m: 1537 dps
GD-22S at 10m: 1589 dps
SAW at 85m: 1392 dps
EM6(better long range) at 75m: 1430 dps
GD-22S at 75m: 1361 dps
I'd imagine if it listed the SAW's 75m value instead of it's 85m it would be closer to or equal to the EM6.
Problem with referring to spreadsheets is that people often fail to interpret what is actually being represented. DPS, for example, is assuming full autofire when the SAW functions like a CounterStrike AK-47 where the first bullet is extremely accurate and every bullet after becomes less and less so because of crazy recoil. It's not going to measure up well in a full autofire comparison.
Are these stats with a naked weapon or fully upgraded?
PS2 seems to use cert upgrades as a form of "balance" so the stats of stock weapons don't really mean much tbh
Default saw is not that bad when fully upgraded. I'm actually starting to favor it atm. It's always a 3 headshot kill which is nice.
It's also important to note the effect of live fire on accuracy. Yes, the SAW has DPS on par with (or better than in some cases) other LMG's, but the slower RoF and higher per-damage shot means each missed shot counts for that much more, and due to the mechanics of aim disruption when under fire, missing with the SAW hurts it's DPS a lot.
No. While the recoil makes it harder to land shots with the damage output is practically the same with all the NC LMGs. Dropping certs on the SAW will make it completely competitive with the other LMGs.
I think its the best LMG for NC my self once i aim down the sights i gun down more or less every one in front easy as hell so in my view its well worth it and if you do and you disagree you only lost a few certs you will earn back later any way.
I have used all the LMG`s and i find the Saws balance suits my play style best it might or might not work for you.
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